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H-M '64 Ford Fairlane

 
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2019 2:42 pm    Post subject: H-M '64 Ford Fairlane Reply with quote

Hoping for help with information and reference for a rather obscure H&M project. As I understand it only (2) '64 Fairlanes were built by Holman & Moody.
A slightly modified version and more robust chassis with NASCAR car style reinforcing. The nearly stock version was destroyed in a towing accident in '64. The more serious effort competed in the '64 Daytona Continental driven by Fireball Roberts (it's only race in the US) before being sold on to Alan Mann to compete as a road racer in Europe. The original surviving car's whereabouts are unknown. HM has more recently built a few recreations. More history here.





Last edited by afx on Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:18 am; edited 6 times in total
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2019 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've already removed the side trim from a Revell T-bolt kit but more modifications will be required.


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tlaferri



Joined: 22 Mar 2018
Posts: 55

PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2019 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can get a close proximity to it using the T-bolt body but the roof actually is diferent between the sedan (Tbolt) and the 500 Hardtop-(like the H/M car). I started out doing the very same mods but it didn't look right and I ended up grafting in the roof section from an AMT Mod Stocker 65 Fairlane onto the Revell Tbolt body- heres some compare pics -first pic is the Tbolt sedan with the b-pillar removed

and this is with the 65 500 hardtops roof grafted on



Besides the rear backlight opening being larger on the 500's roof, the 500's roof itself is shorter and the base of its C-pillar ends in different spot, closer to the front of the car vs the sedans (Look at the base of the c-pillar compared to where it is above the wheel opening) , another good visual is to note how much of the diagonal "kickup" bar can be seen in the sedans quarter window vs in the 500's, this is the same chassis/cage/lower body only with a different roof grafted onto it.
Not intending to slam or dissuade you, my family crewed and sponsored a local driver who ran this same body style for several seasons so I wanted to model his cars as accurately as possible- I started with the same approach initially and I kept looking at it going, "something just doesn't look right" and dug into it deeper, so just passing on info as an FYI to help
Lastly, as an aside, old builtups of the AMT 64 Fairlane 500 sports roof pop up on ebay fairly often at not unreasonable prices and a glue bomb could also serve as a good body donor ( that's actually what Im using for the season three version car of his)
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BVAUGHN



Joined: 29 Jan 2018
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2019 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

H&M took a 64 Fairlane to Atlanta for a test to see if NASCAR would allow Ford to use the Fairlane after Chrysler domination of the Daytona 500. Think Roberts and Lorenzen tested the car NASCAR said no dice.
Bill
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Tom M.
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Joined: 01 Feb 2018
Posts: 600

PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2019 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The cars H-M built in the 2000s are a LOT different from either car that was built in the '60s. Lee calls them continuations or recreations but they're essentially old sheetmetal over modern chassis components.
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KenK



Joined: 27 May 2018
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where did you get those 8-lug wheels on the rear?
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Tom M.
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Joined: 01 Feb 2018
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tlaferri wrote:
You can get a close proximity to it using the T-bolt body but the roof actually is diferent between the sedan (Tbolt) and the 500 Hardtop-(like the H/M car). I started out doing the very same mods but it didn't look right and I ended up grafting in the roof section from an AMT Mod Stocker 65 Fairlane onto the Revell Tbolt body- heres some compare pics -first pic is the Tbolt sedan with the b-pillar removed

and this is with the 65 500 hardtops roof grafted on



Besides the rear backlight opening being larger on the 500's roof, the 500's roof itself is shorter and the base of its C-pillar ends in different spot, closer to the front of the car vs the sedans (Look at the base of the c-pillar compared to where it is above the wheel opening) , another good visual is to note how much of the diagonal "kickup" bar can be seen in the sedans quarter window vs in the 500's, this is the same chassis/cage/lower body only with a different roof grafted onto it.
Not intending to slam or dissuade you, my family crewed and sponsored a local driver who ran this same body style for several seasons so I wanted to model his cars as accurately as possible- I started with the same approach initially and I kept looking at it going, "something just doesn't look right" and dug into it deeper, so just passing on info as an FYI to help
Lastly, as an aside, old builtups of the AMT 64 Fairlane 500 sports roof pop up on ebay fairly often at not unreasonable prices and a glue bomb could also serve as a good body donor ( that's actually what Im using for the season three version car of his)


Back in the day one of the local Alabama racers figured out by accident that if you grafted a sedan rear clip onto a hardtop body by aligning the tulip panel (the stamping that goes between the base of the rear window and the forward edge of the trunk opening) from the sedan with the base of the rear window on the hardtop you ended up with a Fairlane that had about 6" less rear overhang but looked perfectly stock. It was easy to do on a '64 but looked weird on a '63 due to the way the fins tapered. It was almost impossible to get them to align properly with the length removed. Most of where the vertical seam was located was eliminated by the rear wheel cutouts.
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tlaferri



Joined: 22 Mar 2018
Posts: 55

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KenK wrote:
Where did you get those 8-lug wheels on the rear?


I was just messing around with some various mock ups when I originally took these pics, sorry, its been too long now that I don't recall who made the wheels
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom M. wrote:
The cars H-M built in the 2000s are a LOT different from either car that was built in the '60s. Lee calls them continuations or recreations but they're essentially old sheetmetal over modern chassis components.



That was my suspicion and why I was hoping to find some original reference material.
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice work tlaferri. I would love the find a build-able AMT 64 Hardtop. I have yet to find one "reasonably" priced.
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tlaferri



Joined: 22 Mar 2018
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

afx wrote:
Nice work tlaferri. I would love the find a build-able AMT 64 Hardtop. I have yet to find one "reasonably" priced.

yeah, clean and/or the unbuilt ones can be crazy expensive but I've found a couple messy built ups at pretty reasonable prices ($30 or so , which is less than a lot of resin bodies sell for)- both were missing some parts but for a stock car build it wasn't a deal breaker.
Terry
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tlaferri wrote:
afx wrote:
Nice work tlaferri. I would love the find a build-able AMT 64 Hardtop. I have yet to find one "reasonably" priced.

yeah, clean and/or the unbuilt ones can be crazy expensive but I've found a couple messy built ups at pretty reasonable prices ($30 or so , which is less than a lot of resin bodies sell for)- both were missing some parts but for a stock car build it wasn't a deal breaker.
Terry


$30!! - that's a great deal!


Last edited by afx on Sat May 04, 2019 10:45 am; edited 1 time in total
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Sat May 04, 2019 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom Kristensen slashing through the field at Goodwood in one of the recreation cars.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNv4GCrCU10
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Off topic but I'm currently building the AWB Falcon HM built for Phil Bonner. Kit bashing the AMT body with the Moebius Comet A/FX kit.




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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some info from an apparently knowledgeable gentleman I found on the HAMB forum: Discussion starts at the middle of post #663

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/holman-moody-the-history.571847/page-23

Zombie - "was told the 64 Daytona fairlane was built as a feasiblity study by NASCAR to see what was needed to be done to a unibody car to make it suitable for NASCAR racing.

Genuine Jack - "hi zombie- can i ask where you heard that ? i don't mean that to sound like a wise guy , but i'm just wondering where that could've come from , as it makes no sense to me at all .

while nascar might do something like that today , it was a totally different world 47 years ago . first of all , nascar did not have the means to build a car back then . the fairlane was definitely built by holman moody [ and , in fact , i'm suspecting that 2 were built ] . the cars that plymouth and dodge were running back then were unibodies , so what was needed to be done was known . the difference between the fairlane and the mopars was that the fairlane [ and all FoMoCo unibodies at that time] had shock towers , which , at least in the case of this HM fairlane , were removed [ i believe we've posted pix of the fairlane's engine bay showing this ] . this could've been the reason that nascar refused to rule the fairlane as legal , if , in fact , that's what happened - as removing the shock towers would've rendered the car as totally non-stock...at least in nascar's eyes .

in addition , i don't think nascar would've cared about promoting the fairlane in 1964 ; as they would've felt it was ford's problem...and apparently ford felt it was their problem , also . two and a half years later , during ford's boycott , ford had to push hard to get big bill to let them race their 1966 "half-chassis" [nee shock tower unibody ] fairlanes . these fairlanes were "way more" non-stock [ now that's gotta be grammerically incorrect !] than the '64 fairlane was .

no , i don't think nascar built , or had this fairlanr built , themselves . if anything , ford / holman moody might have asked permission to run the fairlane - to see if it was doable / practical .
this is all based on my "somewhat" educated opinion , but i'll stand by it until someone proves me wrong . unfortunately , most of the people who were involved are long gone , so i doubt that we'll ever know for sure .

jack"
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hard to tell if this a sedan (T-bolt) body or a hardtop. This is the Alan Mann Fairlane.


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tlaferri



Joined: 22 Mar 2018
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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

afx wrote:
Hard to tell if this a sedan (T-bolt) body or a hardtop. This is the Alan Mann Fairlane.




its a hardtop/500/Sports roof. The T-Bolt has a fixed B-pillar and its quarter window opening is more angular at the top vs the hardtops has a more curved/rounded upper corner. Also, and you'd have to see them in profile side by side to really see it , but the quarter window opening is larger on the Tbolt sedans, its C pillar is narrower and its set back further over the wheel well than the hardtops
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I finally tracked down a usable AMT body, still need to find glass.

This is what I started with:




Days of scrubbing and soaking in paint stripper only partially removed the paint. More hours sanding has got me to here:



Next challenge beside finding glass, what chassis to use? My guess since it was a test bed of sorts for the '65 cars, the chassis would be fairly stock with the inner fenders in place and maybe twin shocks. Does that sound reasonable?


Last edited by afx on Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:23 am; edited 2 times in total
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tlaferri



Joined: 22 Mar 2018
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:18 am    Post subject: fairlane Reply with quote

Looking good!
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Len Woodruff



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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Location: Frisco, TX

PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice
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afx



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 9:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've begun fitting the Revell T-bolt chassis, I'll post pictures when I get a chance
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