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Op-Ed Editorial on Salvinos NASCAR kits.......

 
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DaveVan



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 1572

PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2019 10:15 pm    Post subject: Op-Ed Editorial on Salvinos NASCAR kits....... Reply with quote

Like them of hate them, the two offerings from Salvinos JR Models have been the most talked about kits on this forum for many many years.....maybe of all time. The talk has ranged from fantastic kits to they are junk. After getting the Olds almost complete and finally getting a Monte Carlo I felt the need to chime in. This is listed as a 'editorial' as it is an opinion piece. But I hope to shine a little light on what these kits are in today's market. So skip this post if you want.....I just felt the need to get this in writing.
The Good
1. Made in USA....The vast majority of manufactures in the hobby industry have moved offshore. They all said it was impossible to tool and manufacture hobby items in the USA and sell them at any price. Salvinos have proven them wrong......or at least it looks that way. Designing, tooling and manufacturing in the USA and most done in southern California....a feat in itself. This may seem like a small thing......but look up all the things we can't do in this country any longer......we didn't need another thing lost.

2. Lead Time: I have worked on a good number of model car kits from start to finish. Most took close to two years....some as many as four years. Some of this time was because the kits were being tooled in China. Their schedule and holidays (New Year causes almost 3 weeks off) and the distance all add time to the project. Revisions and then waiting on test shots can take weeks or months. When Salvinos said they would go from start to finish in less than a year I thought it impossible. And Salvinos pretty much hit the mark. Issues aside the proved it does not take years to develop a kit.

3. Great decals: the biggest issue with the beloved Monogram NASCAR kits were the decals. Almost none of them were contest or even really good shelf models level decals. Mike's fantastic decals are a big step up. And at the MSRP they need to be.

4. Plastic: I like the white creamy plastic that seems to be a pretty good grade compared to the translucent and or brittle cheap plastic we have seen at times. Plastic is the basis of our kits....bad plastic can make a great tooled kit junk.

5. New NASCAR tooling: With the state of our hobby any new tooling is great news. This is not a 'the sky is falling' message. But our hobby, all hobbies, have changed drastically. When I ran a hobby shop during the booming 1990's era I recall ordering Monogram #2900 every Monday morning. In our little shop in Charlotte NC we would order 3 cases a week easy. During race week maybe 6 or 7. Revell molded about 5,000 of the recent NASCAR Ford's. We alone sold more than 5,000 #2900 at our store alone back then. So the ROI on a still costly mold/tooling is lower today than it ever has been. This is not to say we need to accept ANYTHING new but I think Salvinos will get it right IF they stick with it. (Monogram #2900 was DE Sr Monte Carlo kit)

6. Build quality: Set aside the issues like leaf springs on the Olds and details that many of us disagree with......the fit of many parts is state of the art. Some items almost snap in place with good positive locators. There are a few items that do not have fantastic fit or even locators.....and this is what causes some of the negative comments......great in one area....barely OK in others. But when it's right it's great. Let's hope going forward this is more constant. It's an easy fix.

7. Subject matter: There are tons of cars us old timers want to see kitted. The OLDS was a good place to start. Again ignoring the issue we all know of. The Monte Carlo is another great pick....SO many teams and drivers can be built. And with Salvinos showing a HEMI CAD drawing and already having a Dodge/Plymouth chassis there are lots of oprions. I hope we get a 77 Thunderbird.

So in the end I say thanks to Salvinos for taking a chance and catering to a small segment of a small hobby. You have plenty of room to improve and tons of options going forward. I hope you do both.....improve with each kit and bring us a few more of the missing links in NASCAR history.

The not so good
1. Many of the short comings of the OLDS kit have been covered in depth here. Salvinos is trying to address them with added parts and retooling. So while there were plenty of start up issues, I hope they continue to try and fix things. If they accept the suggestions offered, in the right way, most items can be fixed.

2. Box Art: The box art is a little flat. It has zero affect of weather any of us here buy or not.....but on a shelf in a store they do not draw the attention needed. Bias alert! I worked on the Moebius NASCAR Hudson and Chrysler kits.....But Sean's box art were classy and exciting. The Salvinos box art is serviceable but not excellent.

3. Instructions: Again the instructions are OK....but a bit crowded and at times confusing to those folks that have not build hundreds of NASACAR kits like many of us have. An easy fix.

So today I still have a wait and see attitude about Salvinos. They can become a Revell/Monogram replacement or a niche supplier. Two kits do not a company make. The next new body tool will make or break things. My biggest suggestion to Salvinos is to be open to help. I have offered free help.....and if you don't like me I know of 8 or 10 guys that are willing to provide input. We are not trying to tell Salvinos what to do.....it is selfish in a way. If our input helps make a better product...we as modelers get a better model, Salvinos sells more kits...we all win. Monogram, Revell and Moebius all asked for outside help and I myself saw how it improved the end product. I hope this is the start of something great......it's all salvinos call. Thanks
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TG
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good info and insight.
My expectations when I buy a kit are a straight body and chassis, parts that fit and that the body sets on the chassis like it should and good decals. Then I can detail them as much or little as I want from there.

I don't have the skill or desire to rebuild the body like Adam has and don't expect to have to when I buy a kit.


What I'm getting from this post is that these are less than Revell quality but still decent kits that build up nicely.

I was not going to get any but now I am interested in building one.
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BVAUGHN



Joined: 29 Jan 2018
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great job Dave.
Thanks for dealing with facts both pro and con.
Have bought the 3 kits offered and waiting on #4.
Since i build more straight from the box i really appreciate the quality and accruacy of the decal sheet plus makes it easier to get aftermarket decals too.
Bill
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sentsat71



Joined: 03 Feb 2018
Posts: 1237
Location: Fenton, IA

PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great post, Dave!

To add a little bit, in the FEB 2019 issue of Scale Auto, noted builder Clay Kemp shows how he built his version, and yes, he politely pointed out the faults of the kit but also pointed out how right things were......

For me, the price is out of my price range, but then most kits are today.....

But if and when Salvino's puts out a 71/72 Ply and 71-74 Charger(s) that might get my interest.....
Only because these days I find the later '60's to around mid to late '70's are of more interest for me.....
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Mack



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 10:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave, I would say you're spot on and fair. Thanks for your insights.
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Pat Redmond
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2019 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And THAT'S how it's done. Thank you, Dave.
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halfbreed999



Joined: 31 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Dave for the Pro and cons of this.
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Tom M.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would also add that the bodies tend to look better in person than in photos online. The discrepancies in body lines on both kits have been well documented and we don't need to rehash them here but the bodies in my hand and on my bench look like what they're supposed to be. This is my era, my first new car was a '70s GM colonnade coupe and I've been up close and personal with these cars in stock and NASCAR form so I probably tend to notice the shapes and contours more than most people but these bodies are close enough for me to build rather than stick back in the box until I get around to reworking it.

Oh, and speaking of boxes... One con that should be an easy fix is to make the box top and bottom actually fit together and not need to be practically peeled apart. Being frustrated by the time I get the box open the first time isn't a good start and the top never goes back on the box once I get it open.
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Mack



Joined: 28 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom M. wrote:
I would also add that the bodies tend to look better in person than in photos online. The discrepancies in body lines on both kits have been well documented and we don't need to rehash them here but the bodies in my hand and on my bench look like what they're supposed to be. This is my era, my first new car was a '70s GM colonnade coupe and I've been up close and personal with these cars in stock and NASCAR form so I probably tend to notice the shapes and contours more than most people but these bodies are close enough for me to build rather than stick back in the box until I get around to reworking it.

Oh, and speaking of boxes... One con that should be an easy fix is to make the box top and bottom actually fit together and not need to be practically peeled apart. Being frustrated by the time I get the box open the first time isn't a good start and the top never goes back on the box once I get it open.


i wanted to simply remove the top of my first Monte Carlo kit. Check the kit out and put the top back on. Of course I neatly cut the plastic around the bottom, so as to slip the top back in place. No such luck. Ripped the end off of the top. But that's not a deal breaker for me.
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DaveVan



Joined: 27 Jan 2018
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tom M. wrote:
Oh, and speaking of boxes... One con that should be an easy fix is to make the box top and bottom actually fit together and not need to be practically peeled apart. Being frustrated by the time I get the box open the first time isn't a good start and the top never goes back on the box once I get it open.

Again Tom.......we are on the same page!!! Your comments on the body are spot on.

I was going to say something about the box and how hard it is to open.....I figured it was me and my arthritis hands.....or I figured folks may call me petty.....but thanks for the confirmation. I've packed model kits on an assembly line for AMII....I an't imagine putting these together!!!
Positive note....they ain't doughnut boxes!!! Rolling Eyes
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BVAUGHN



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree 100% on how hard the boxes are to open. Being 69 years old I thought it was just me!
Bill
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Tom M.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaveVan wrote:
I was going to say something about the box and how hard it is to open.....I figured it was me and my arthritis hands.....or I figured folks may call me petty.....but thanks for the confirmation. I've packed model kits on an assembly line for AMII....I an't imagine putting these together!!!
Positive note....they ain't doughnut boxes!!! Rolling Eyes


I thought my first Olds kit was just an early run and they would adjust the box fit but I have opened Olds kits from different batches and now a Monte Carlo kit and they all fit the same. It should be an easy fix but I know they're a smaller operation and that's very low on the priority list.

I was reminded of how horrible the doughnut boxes were when I grabbed an original issue Revell Daytona to check the fit of the Salvino's chassis a couple of days ago. By the way, the Olds chassis fits very nicely. The Monte Carlo won't due to the wider roll cage in the Monte Carlo kit. I assume the narrower sides aren't included, I haven't dug much deeper than the body in the Monte Carlo kit because I needed it to size some decals.
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hemiman_1999



Joined: 29 Jan 2018
Posts: 296

PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2019 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My first MC kit had the same issues "Tight Fitting Lid" in fact as careful as I tried to be it still ripped on the side seams on both sides. You are right its a minor issue but for storage a good box is essential also I when building a model I like to keep parts in the box on my bench until they are used and as finished sub-assemblies are completed keep them in the box, so to me a ripped box is a pain in the butt. Also if you notice the prices people are paying for empty old boxes its money gone I had some old empty MPC NASCAR boxes from the early 70s I thought I would get a couple of bucks each for 14 boxes I got $136.00 I am still in shock over that and that was a year ago.
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