Randy Ayers Nascar Modeling Forums

[DPalmer4343]

I'm in a "get off my lawn" mood today, so at lunch, I went to my local hobby shop because that (not Disney) is truly the happiest place on earth. Since the early 70's, when my dad would take me to Joes Hobby Shop or Hobby House, I found peace and wonder within a hobby shop. Race cars that I saw on tv in model form. My dad's cool car in model form. Airplanes hanging from the ceiling. When I finally was lucky enough to be a store manager at the local hobby shop, I transformed it to emulate the experience that I had in my youth. When a kid would come in and look through the models, I didn't harass them, I encouraged them. Kids 16 and younger got 10% off. Want to see what an airbrush can do? We had one set up in the back for them to try. Wanted to see what a "tougher" kit (i.e. Gunze, Tamiya, etc) was like, let's open it up and see. Screwed up your kit? C'mon in and let's take a look at it and figure out how to fix it. The adults, I didn't care so much about because they already KNEW what they wanted. Sure we offered them exceptional service, but I wanted to focus on the KIDS. That's the future. And while I couldn't do anything to stop the cost of kits and glue and paint from rising, I did my best to make it affordable. So that a kid could take a $20 and walk out with a kit, glue, and some paint. It was supposed to be a hobby that didn't break the bank. Not like other hobbies. The parents wouldn't balk when the kid asked to go to the hobby shop.

So I go into my local shop today and it's deserted. Great selection but.....it's no wonder kids (let alone adults) are leaving in droves. Let's start with the price. $40 for an AMT/Monogram kit. Of a re-release of a re-release of a mold that probably hasn't been touched in years. Want to build a race car that you see on TV? Nope, but we got a cool kit of a 40 year old race car that your dad would remember. Oh, and it's $40. How about a car you see driving around? Well, if you want a Mustang, there's one ($40). I think there's a Camaro around. Indy? nope. Funny car? Nope. How about a cool fire engine? Yeah, there's one on the top shelf for $65. Ok, you got some cash saved from mowing lawns and that Mustang will make a cool kit. Wait, you need glue! and PAINT. Got another $20 on ya, because it's $5-8 a can for paint. The jars? 1/2 ounce will cost ya $4. Detail kits? Wait, you want to try and add wires and hoses? Maybe try your hand at flocking the interior? Mow some more lawns kid, you'll be out another $20-30 before you get too far.

I know that the attention span of the kid nowadays is about 3 seconds and that there are more exciting things to do than to sit and glue your fingers together on a rainy afternoon....but how can we expect the next generation to carry on this hobby when I nearly fainted when the Tamiya re-release of the 1/24 Datsun 280z was more than a dinner for me, my family and my neighbors at the local eatery? (it was $65...I'm cheap at dinner). I mean, really?

I'm going to step off the soapbox and go back in the corner and listen to the discussions of the latest Salvino's release or which color Harry Gant's Skoal Olds is in a shake can. And I'll go back to remembering what it was like during the "good old days" and wonder if any of those kids I helped are building anything today. And someday, some kid will get within earshot and they'll ask what I did for fun when I was a kid. I'll tell them how I imagined being Richard Petty while trying to mask that damn STP paint job on his Charger or how I spend an entire day trying to figure out how to simulate spark plug wires with thread and paint. Then the kid will laugh, think I'm making it all up, and go back to playing Fortnite.

Sorry for the intrusion

[DaveVan]

CHANGE....the only constant.......
EVERYTHING in our lives has changed.....even our little tiny hobby.
Yes...shortages and slow shipping has made things very different.

The other side is we have 2 new model companies making kits I did not think we'd ever see along with reissues that were selling in the hundreds now available under $30.
R2 has a news conference today at 16:00 about new stuff.....no it ain't cheap....but the fact anyone wants to invest in our tiny market is amazing. When I ran a hobby shop back 1980' thru mid 90's I'd order 3-4 cases of Monogram #2900 every Monday. The hobby can not support that kind sales today....and it costs more to make a model....perfect storm.

It is what you make it. Plastic models to costly?? Go buy a new Lionel model train locomotive at $3,000.00. Or tires for your vintage car @ $2,000 plus install and tax.

Yes...I own kits in my collection with K Mart stickers on them for $1.68....but we ain't going back.

[Firefly]

And just like the sport itself, it's been a gradual change, and we all have different opinions on what point in time exactly that things started in an unhappy direction.

For me it was maybe around 1972, when the big kit manufacturers cut back on annual street stock releases. I was so disappointed I could not get a kit of my favorite car - a '72 Torino ("get of my lawn" for sure!).
_________________
Bill Jobson is my real name.

[jchrisf]

[jjsipes]

I'm trying to get my 9 yr son involved into cars. This year I have taken him to a couple big car shows for the first time and he really enjoyed. I'm also trying to get him into models. He was so excited when we walked into a local vintage toy store and he saw the MPC 1/16 scale General Lee. Mind you it was $75 but, he wanted. He and I walked around the store and talked about it and decided to getit for him. I decided to paint the body today since the heat and humidity has broken finally and he's getting all excited. He will working on it with me. It will be our 3rd model together.

He is what it looks like after one coat of paint.

[DaveVan]

[jchrisf]

[LastoftheV8]

I'd like to offer my .02 that the modeling hobby would have more popularity amongst the young and casual hobbyists if the designs would actually come up with designs and molded parts that fit together. there are dozens of extremely skilled and patient elder folks who have the tools, skills and workspace to get around these flaws. heck maybe most of you think thats "fun" or part of the hobby. But I personally think its a problem. even the most recent release kits dont' get together properly in many areas and the re-releases simply spit out the same problems the kits already have. I seriously wonder if these companies actually have their employees try to assembly the kits before they ship them as a review process. I'm not an engineer or designer but I can show my 7 year old son two pieces I made on a 3d printer and he can tell me in 5 seconds, "great work dad" or "nope, you need to try again" when he puts them together. I was given the assignment with another Dad, to come up with a model building workshop for out scout troop. He's a fellow modeler and we tried several, I mean several, kits before we found one we thought wouldn't discourage them from the hobby. kits they could simply paint, decal and glue and have a nice looking car. It was an AMT Nova BTW.

[DaveVan]

I don't agree kits TOOLED in the last 20 years do not fit well. Kits from the 1960's reissued still have many of the problems they had back in the day when they were a #1.50 kit. If you have built any of the newly tooled Revell or Moebius kits the go together as well as the best Tamiya kit does. Disclaimer...I did some work for Moebius...but their pick ups, Hudson and Chrysler kits go together VERY well......positive locators and joints that are clean and even. I have put together some of these Moebius kits testing the fit, without glue and they stay together they fir so well. If you are talking kits and tooling that is almost 50-60 years old, fit can be an issue.

Round2/AMT says they are doing two all new kits of current cars....we will see how they turn out. But their new tool Sci-Fi kits are very well done so lets hope.

[jchrisf]

[MarkJ]

[WR]

I will say Salvinos has breathed some more life into the hobby.

[DaveVan]

[sentsat71]

DaveVan...

K hear ya' on any scale of model railroading!!
When we moved from FL to NM in 2005....I tossed a number of kits and even more buildds from the 1970's as i thought I would try and get back to model reailrpoading.
BUT, when i went to a local model train only shop in AVQ, I about fainted when I saw what an Athearn RTR F7 locomotive was selling for!!! That's when I knew I screwed up in dumping all those builds and some kits......!!

But by then too, even though I tried to get back into building model cars in 2006, that desire soon left me....though at times I've bought many a kit, some have been sold, never started, and still kept buying kits.....so basically I just add to my collection of kits, even though, when I buy them, I have an idea or two of what i want to try and build.....the box may make it to the WIP table, then eventually gets put back ion the storage shelves......

If and when Salvinos produce the '71/'72 Plymjouth, I may get one or two.....depending on my finances at the time....just to have them. those two years have been my all time favorite style for the Roadrunner/satellite!!
I have the R/M 1/24th Ply GTX and the F&F GTX version the other style hood (side vents?)
And yes, they are still sitting in the boxes....
_________________
Ed. K

[bangor boy]

Amazing to see a zombie thread get exhumed to give everyone an opportunity for therapeutic barking.

Like privatized health care, this hobby, like any hobby. is there for those that can afford it. It's a luxury, not a necessity. And clearly it's working in that way. Stuff shifts every day on ebay and social media for the going rate.

I'm not sure we should get all hand-wringingly ecumenical or worry-filled over those that can't afford kits or accessories. Those that can will. Those that can't won't. It may be an inconvenient truth, but it's the American way.

[Gary66]

[sentsat71]

To borrow a term from the mode;l railroad hobby...
Though in a way, I've been an ARM CHAIR MODEL RAILROADER, and still am....
I guess I would be an Arm Chiar model car builder, as in every car kit I've bought over the years, after trying to restart my car building back in 2006, which died rather quickly, I have had ideas of what I wanted to do with the kit, whether out of the box, or used for parts towards another kit. some of the 30's Ford kits were initially bought to be turned into various modifieds. others were bought to use certain parts for another kit, etc. etc, etc.
And that's where those kits still sit waiting and waiting and waiting......

Would you believe that there are still some survivors from this pic taken in the late 1970's (Film was developed in Jan 1971)

5 vehicles still exist, plus 3 trailers from early 1960's AMT Ford (2) and Chevy (1) pickup kits.
The well cut up AMT 1969/40 sedan kit was shortly changed after this pic was taken and replaced by an AMT '62(?) Chevy II body that fit perfectly on the frame. But the whee abouts of that rebuild still remain a mystery today. I just disappeared......
.....
_________________
Ed. K

[Gary66]

Debated to really dig into this , but here goes:

The problem is a lot of the old guys in the hobby look at the future the wrong way.

They ask "how do we get kids to build models" when what they really mean is "how do we get kids to build a model of old cars that we like".

Don't get me wrong, I'm not here to kick Round2 , but how many teens are going to get excited about a 1963 Chevy 2 wagon or a 1964 Cutlass? I doubt most in the 13-18 age group have ever seen either one. You want kids in the hobby? Then you better offer kits of what they and their friends drive, in most cases these days that means an import with tuner parts. The only American cars would be Mustangs and Camaros, maybe a Challenger. I do think a kit of the Hellcat would sell.

Another thing: Round 2 has figured out to get young people involved you need to be in Walmart. But you can't keep re-popping 50 to 60 year old tools and expect the youth to be interested, unless it's a lowrider (and that's a maybe).

Salvino's has a target group (old guys who like racing the way it used to be) but even they are smart enough to get on board with a modern Nascar kit for the people still watching the races today. And I think that's great.

You want the hobby to live, get youth involved. You want youth involved, better offer what they know and like. It won't be a repop of a 60 year old kit of a car they have most likely never seen.

That's just my thoughts, your mileage may vary.

[Lionpride]

Excellent reply, and all true!

[Pat Redmond]

The hobby is what you make of it.
_________________
<< On The Bench --- 2022 Elliott Hooters

[DaveVan]

Gary......
They may have heard you.
Last Thursday R2 announced they are doing two all new tools of current 'hot' cars.
Also R2 is working it's way back into mass marketers. Many WM got a pallet shipper with a bunch of kits. But WM has to WANT to sell kits....R2 is trying

Now on the other side.....cost......some new kits by US manufactures are getting to the $40-50 range.....THAT will be an issue.
thx

[Bob B]

A very interesting thread here folks. I've enjoyed reading the comments and thoughts so far. For me, I build what I like and truly enjoy the investigative research needed to construct an authentic representation of the real racer.
Bob B

[Gary66]

[Dennis O]

While I like to keep my money, models are my #1 pastime. I will spend money on quality stuff. If a kit is a quality piece I'll spend the bucks. What I won't do is pay $45 for a re-pop of an old kit using old molds with old problems.
_________________
Dennis
Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity.......

[Schumacher330]

[bangor boy]

And maybe refrain from bashing modern day racing.

Everything looks better in the sepia toned nostalgia of our youth, when we were first captivated by the sport and the heroes racing created back in the day.

Kids don't give a flying farthing about yesterday. They want now. I watched the Southern 500 this weekend. Pretty compelling event. Close, competitive racing with the Lady in Black having her say in how cars and the contenders driving them would finish.

You don't have to look too far afield to find all kinds of old codgers bellyaching about how it wasn't as good as back in the day. Yeah, when Petty or Pearson or Johnny Leadfoot would win by multiple laps over a thin field rapidly diminished by attrition and thin budgets.

Don't tell kids nonsense. Today's racing is absolutely more competitive and compelling. YOU may not like the changes in the sport. They may think otherwise. Go with the flow and keep their interest and enthusiasm percolating.

I am aware in saying this that the options for building plastic scale models of current cars is significantly diminished compared to NASCAR's peak years. But it is by no means barren. There's plenty of options out there to engage newcomers.

With a nice stash of good kits to work with, I'm looking forward to introducing my grandchildren (hurry up kids!) to the hobby someday and it won't be just about building a race car kit. There has to be context - stories about drivers and cars and tracks and races to go along with it.

But it won't simply be about building NASCAR race cars. Anything they want to build - planes, trains, automobiles - will be fine with me. I want to build a scale model of my prized 1979 Glastron Carlson CVZ 19 power boat. Or something Jackie Stewart or Jim Hall drove. Or a deHavilland Beaver float plane.

As long as they get a chance to learn the intrinsic value of model building. Learning how to research a subject is a valuable skill. Learning how to prepare parts and accessories is a valuable skill. Learning how to properly use paint and other materials is a valuable skill. Anything that helps them develop patience, planning and an eye for detail is so valuable moving forward in life.

[MarkJ]

Well said , Bangor. I agree with the inspiration part of the build. I usually like to go back to something that I was interested in as a kid or teenager and build it, so in the process of researching it, I learn more about it. I cant just build a model because it looks cool. I have to have a personal connection to it. Since it usually takes me 2 or 3 months to complete a build, without the inspiration, I would never finish it.